TITANS OF NUCLEAR

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1 - 00:50 - Introduction to Used Fuel Management

Naomi Senehi: Where did you grow up and how did you get into the nuclear space?

Marc Nichol: Marc Nichol was born in Michigan and moved around while growing up, landing in Reston, Virginia outside of D.C. for a majority of his adolescence. Nichol pursued his undergraduate degree in nuclear engineering at Purdue University and his graduate degree, also in nuclear engineering, at University of California at Berkeley. Later, Nichol received his MBA at UNC. As part of a high school science project, Nichol studied propulsion, which led him to discover nuclear propulsion. Purdue has a research reactor on-campus, which allows students to use the facility and learn about the physics of nuclear reactions. One project Nichol completed as an undergraduate looked at challenges with storing used fuel in pools for Exelon. This led Nichol to a co-op with TRW, the contractor to the Department of Energy for the Yucca Mountain project. Initially, Nichol was drawn toward fusion, but transitioned his focus to fission machines due to their prevalence in the industry and near term opportunities. Fusion does not generate as much radioactive material and has some safety benefits, but obtaining the net energy out of fusion is not quite developed yet. Nichol’s master’s thesis project was optimizing the storage of used fuels within the pools at a Duke Energy facility. After completing his master’s program, Nichol began his career at Duke Energy in used fuel management, responsible for managing storage in the pools and transferring spent fuel into dry storage. Dry storage is a large, air-cooled metal container backfilled with helium that can hold 24 assemblies.

2 - 10:04 - Current Status and Potential of Yucca Mountain

Naomi Senehi: Is nuclear waste something that we should be worried about?

Marc Nichol: Marc Nichol believes the final, long-term solution for nuclear waste still needs improvement. U.S. law stipulates that nuclear waste goes to the Yucca Mountain facility and the industry funds the disposal of used fuel through an operations tax. The Government is responsible for this disposal by contract. Nichol is supportive of the Yucca Mountain site and sees it as both a viable and a safe facility, even though there are some non-supporters on the political front. In the 1987, the U.S. Government designated Yucca Mountain, in Nevada, as the site for the repository, where used fuel is placed permanently. A large tunnel was mined into the mountain, with multiple alcoves for testing in different geology. Sometime during Obama’s administration, the Government stopped funding the project. Yucca Mountain is far along in development and the Nuclear Regulatory Commission (NRC) had reviewed a lot of the safety bases for the site, however there is still work to be done to make a final license determination on the site. No nuclear waste has been transferred to the site at this time. Industry is looking at sites in New Mexico and Texas to create other options to centralize the spent fuel and take it away from reactor sites, where it is currently being stored. The utilities sued the U.S. Government for breach of contract and is required to pay out the utilities for the cost of dry storage on-site.

3 - 22:22 - Cost Comparison and Market Analysis of Advanced Reactors

Naomi Senehi: Where did you go after Duke Energy?

Marc Nichol: After his time at Duke Energy, Marc Nichol pursued his MBA at the University of North Carolina. From there, Nichol joined Toshiba, who was currently working on the South Texas project new power plant Units 3 and 4. This was about the time of the nuclear renaissance, but due to the low prices of natural gas, the nuclear industry began to unfold. Nichol transitioned to the Nuclear Energy Institute (NEI) addressing generic used fuel issues, later moving into quality control and small modular reactors (SMR’s), units that are less than 300 MW. The regulations the Nuclear Regulatory Commission (NRC) put in place were developed for large, 1,000 MW reactors and are often very prescriptive on systems and components. As the plant is scaled down, some of those features are not needed and the requirements may not be applicable. The NRC requires off-site power, but SMR’s are able to infinitely maintain a cool core even without power, eliminating the need for off-site power. Some companies are developing microreactors, usually less than 10 MW, to service remote areas that may not have the load to sustain SMR’s. The NEI published a report analyzing the cost and economic viability of microreactors. Microreactors do reflect an economy of scale, bringing more expensive power than SMR’s, but do compete with diesel generators which typically service the same areas microreactors are targeting and brings energy security. Microreactors also have the ability to operate 24/7/365 with enough fuel for ten years, eliminating the need for frequent refueling.

4 - 31:58 - Economic Benefits of Microreactor Deployment in Alaska

Naomi Senehi: Did you look at how much the cost of diesel varies compared the availability and cost of nuclear fuel for microreactors?

Marc Nichol: Nuclear fuel is relatively cheap and fairly stable over many years, however, diesel fuel cost is very volatile. Oil prices typically spike quickly in a matter of a year or two and there is not much time to react. Marc Nichol recently visited the University of Alaska at Anchorage and held a workshop to discuss nuclear reactors with interested stakeholders. Communities, electric utilities, mining companies, and defense installations were among those in attendance. There is tremendous interest for microreactors in Alaska because the cost to the consumer may be almost $1/kW. Alaska does have a subsidization program for remote locations, which could bring down the cost to customer to $0.60/kW. This puts more money in the pockets of individuals of the community and reduce the subsidization program across the board, lowering taxes for other residents. Mining companies typically pay a lot for their electricity; microreactors would allow mines to operate longer, since lower grade ore becomes more profitable. Alaska currently does not have much value-add processes in the state, which could be driven by the cost of energy. If the cost of energy went down, these industries could thrive and bring income to the state. Alaska’s national defense program could also benefit from microreactors, which allow separation from the grid and a highly reliable, robust power source.

5 - 39:28 - Creating Energy Policy for Advanced Reactors

Naomi Senehi: What’s the status of putting microreactors in remote locations?

Marc Nichol: Marc Nichol attended a Senate hearing on microreactors during a visit to Alaska. Microreactors would bring economic benefits to the state on many levels and some Senators are very supportive of that pursuit. The technology is rapidly maturing, with 15 designs currently in development. Translating years of technical knowledge into commercial designs is the focus of these companies. The Nuclear Regulatory Commission (NRC) also needs to have a regulatory pathway for microreactors and is capable of issuing licenses, but the process needs improvement. All this progress in design and regulation development is happening in parallel. Policies need to be in place to encourage the deployment of microreactors. One bill in the Senate now, called the Nuclear Energy Leadership Act, have provisions that could help microreactors and other advanced reactors, such as power purchase agreement authorities. This would allow, for example, the Department of Defense could enter into a longer term agreement for microreactors; this is important because the assets have a large capital cost and operate for a long time. Other provisions could help with providing low enriched uranium up to 20% Uranium-235; the commercial industry currently enriches up to 5%. The commercial supply isn’t going to materialize until there is demand from new reactors, but the reactors can’t be built if there is not the supply of fuel.

6 - 45:01 - Momentum of Microreactors and Nuclear Energy

Naomi Senehi: What do you see for the future of microreactors and nuclear energy?

Marc Nichol: Marc Nichol anticipates an increase of interest and activity around microreactors. A demonstration reactor could be possible around 2023. This development is especially quick for the nuclear industry. Commercial microreactors could be online in 2027, with licensing and construction activities lining up to support the deployment. There is a huge momentum for nuclear energy in general, including support of existing nuclear plants that have been troubled by the market and also, advanced reactors. Nichol’s expects slow but steady progress in the next ten years, when the public will realize how nuclear is changing the world.

7 - 48:49 - Considerations for Used Fuel from Advanced Reactors

Naomi Senehi: What does used fuel look like for microreactors and SMR’s?

Marc Nichol: Since microreactors are able to operate for 10-20 years on a single fuel loading, there will be smaller amounts of used fuel per MW generated. There are microreactor and small modular reactor (SMR) designs in progress that could reduce the amount of used fuel in our inventory today, by burning the used fuel or use it as the source of fuel. Used fuel still contains about 95% of its energy available, which is not sufficient for large reactors, but could be used in some advanced reactor designs. This will not be a feature in the first deployments, but is in consideration for future designs. The economics of using used fuel does not support its use right now, but if the cost of uranium goes up, there could be an economic case to recycle. One of the concepts for the Yucca Mountain site is to monitor the used fuel for 100 years and have the ability to retrieve that fuel if needed for a safety issue, performance maintenance, or policy reasons surrounding recycling fuel. Microreactors can produce heat in addition to electricity, which becomes beneficial in mining and industrial applications. Some communities where these microreactors might be deployed, such as in the Arctic, use more heat energy than electric energy. The ability to produce both heat and electricity benefits the community as a whole and takes diesel out of the picture, with the exception of the transportation sector. Transportation with hydrogen fuels, which can produced at nuclear reactors, is currently in development.

Q1 - Tokuhiro's Entrance into Nuclear

Naomi Senehi: How did you get involved in the nuclear space?

Akira Tokuhiro: In his early years, Akira Tokuhiro was interested in racecar design, but found it very challenging to get a job in the industry. He was drawn to systems engineering and became interested in nuclear energy, receiving his PhD in nuclear engineering from Purdue. During his graduate program, he completed experimental work for heat transfer in a fusion reactor design. Tokuhiro’s thesis topic was centered on how the magnetic field of liquid metal cooling affects its heat transfer abilities. Tokuhiro started working in nuclear reactor design research and development, with the European Fast Reactor program, not starting his career in academia until 2000 at three different universities in the U.S. He joined on with NuScale Power, where he worked on development from 75% to 100% design completion for two and a half years. Akira Tokuhiro is currently the Dean and a Professor in the Engineering Systems and Nuclear Department at the Ontario Tech University. Before academia, Tokuhiro also worked on development of an integral test facility for General Electric’s simplified boiling water reactor (SBWR).

Q2 - Japanese Sodium Cooled Fast Reactor

Naomi Senehi: What did you go on to do after working on GE’s simplified boiling water reactor?

Akira Tokuhiro: After working on GE’s simplified boiling water reactor (SBWR), Akira Tokuhiro was invited to be an institute research fellow at what is now the Japan Atomic Energy Agency. He supported the development of the Japanese sodium cooled fast reactor between 1995 and 2000. A fast reactor is important for a closed nuclear fuel cycle and is very compact. Sodium is a very good coolant, but must be kept under a cover gas. Tokuhiro supported the ultrasonic doppler velocimetry measurements, which required development of new measurement methods since the material is opaque. Tokuhiro considers himself an innocent bystander for multiple incidents, such as the Kobe earthquake, the Tokyo sarin attack, a sodium leak at a fast reactor demonstration plant, which caused a major fire, and the criticality accident at Tokaimura which happened when workers didn’t know they were switching between low enrichment and high enrichment fuel.

Q3 - Tokuhiro's Debut in Academia

Naomi Senehi: Where did you go following your time in Japan?

Akira Tokuhiro: After ten years of research and development, Akira Tokuhiro started his career in academia at the University of Missouri in Rolla. He started submitting applications for Department of Energy grants for the university, receiving grants for research reactor instrumentation, application of polymer gels for radioactive waste processing, and testing the heat exchanger for supercritical CO2 loops. In 2001, Tokuhiro published a paper comparing risk as a spectrum and how safety culture is different for automobiles, commercial airline flights, and nuclear reactors. His order of magnitude analysis looks at the amplification factor that the mass media exercises for each industry, such as fatality statistics. The level of acceptance is the ratio of the perception of the benefit to the perception of the risk. Tokuhiro also was responsible for the University of Missouri - Rolla reactor, as the director and licensed operator for five years. In order to receive his license from the Nuclear Regulatory Commission, Tokuhiro was tested on knowledge of the facility, how fuel is moved, what the license entails, etc. When 9/11 happened, the university went on lockdown, the reactor was shut down, and Tokuhiro acted as the public liaison for the university’s reactor. As part of the aftermath, had to install additional biometric security measures at the university reactor, such as facial recognition and fingerprint scanning.

Q4 - Advanced Reactor Safety Design

Naomi Senehi: During your time working at the plant, what were some of your lessons learned?

Akira Tokuhiro: As the director and licensed operator for the experimental reactor at the University of Missouri in Rolla, Akira Tokuhiro was able to support a high school student interested in pursuing and receiving an operating license for the reactor. After Rolla, Tokuhiro spent two years at Kansas State University, then transitioned to the University of Idaho in Idaho Falls. Tokuhiro continued working in advanced reactor safety design and a project with Argonne National Labs analyzing air cooling and water cooling of decay heat. In the development of advanced reactors, such as the German-designed pebble-bed reactor, safety issues and challenges are identified. These tennis ball sized graphite sphere in a container move during online refueling. During movement, graphite dust is created and considerations needed to be taken for control and management of the dust due to its high flammability. Tokuhiro also worked on the very high temperature reactor (VHTR), a graphite-moderated nuclear reactor. On shutdown, decay heat cooling must be required due to the temperature limitations of the concrete vault; both air-cooled and water-cooled solutions were considered. While working in Idaho, Tokuhiro took an opportunity to work for NuScale Power in 2014.

Q5 - Involvement After Fukushima

Naomi Senehi: What was your involvement with the Fukushima incident?

Akira Tokuhiro: After the hydrogen explosion at Fukushima, which resulted of melting fuel or damaged cladding, Akira Tokuhiro received many phone calls from the media due to his role as a nuclear professor. Tokuhiro participated in a blog on LinkedIn started to share information about the accident between industry experts. The American Nuclear Society (ANS) selected Tokuhiro to be on the President’s committee for the accident. The committee addressed communication and management as it relates to both risks and crises. During his visit to Fukushima, Tokuhiro witnessed the destruction of the tsunami and some of the clean-up efforts. Approximately 40 years of work is needed to complete decommissioning. In subsequent trips, Tokuhiro studied the effects of the radiation cloud on the surrounding plant and animal life. One finding was that the radiation was strongest at the base of trees, due to the radiation cloud and rain.

Q6 - NuScale Power Development

Naomi Senehi: Tell me more about your experience at NuScale Power.

Akira Tokuhiro: NuScale Power was much further ahead in completion of design compared to other small modular reactors (SMR’s). Tokuhiro was on a team to establish the technical basis for the emergency planning zone (EPZ). Due to their size, SMR’s require a much small EPZ than traditional nuclear plants. The NuScale SMR design is a natural circulation design which doesn’t have a pump and much fewer valves and piping components. The steam generator is integrated into the reactor pressure vessel. One benefit of the small modular reactors is being able to tap into the mass manufacturing industry that typically manufacture large components. The SMR’s are small enough to be placed on a semi or a barge. The reactor vessel is inside a containment which sits inside a pool. The integration design, fewer components, and natural cooling all contribute to safety benefits of SMR’s. Akira Tokuhiro now runs the only nuclear engineering program in Canada at Ontario Tech University, with about 300 undergraduates studying at this time.

Q7 - Nuclear Education Opportunities

Naomi Senehi: What’s next for you and what do you see coming down the line for nuclear?

Akira Tokuhiro: Akira Tokuhiro is the Dean and Professor of the College of Energy Systems in Nuclear Science. Climate change and nuclear power has come to the forefront in terms of social license and public discussion. Tokuhiro is kicking off a new Bachelor of Technology program in Sustainable Energy Systems at the university. There is also a new degree to produce energy analysts and energy communications, both aimed at supporting the nuclear energy industry as a whole and widening the umbrella of nuclear power expertise.

1 – (00:35) Upbringing & Collegiate History

Naomi Senehi: Where did you grow up? Tell me about your upbringing.

Jackie Kempfer: I grew up in Newburn, North Carolina. It’s become quite a tourist destination recently, but when I was growing up it was very small and quiet, near the beach, though I don’t surf much. I completed my undergrad at East Carolina University. When I first arrived, I wasn’t sure what I wanted to do there, so I ended up leaving school eventually, and worked with a contracting company that opened and trained staff in home improvement stores across the US. I learned to use power tools, traveled a lot, and trained lots of young people how to maneuver and operate the stores. I got burnt out of that job eventually, so I returned to North Carolina and waited tables for a while, then went back to school for history. After completing my undergrad, I worked within the Dean’s office of the college, and learned how narrow professor’s research can be, which pointed me towards NC State University to pursue a Master’s in International Relations, where I simultaneously worked as the Executive Assistant to the Director for the university’s recreation center.

2 – (09:29) Graduate Experiences that led to Nuclear

Naomi Senehi: I respect and appreciate the strong work ethic you retained throughout your undergrad and graduate career.

Jackie Kempfer: Yes, well there were many moments of frustration and confusion, for sure, but I had quite a few strong mentors that pointed me on my best path. When I was in high school, I would volunteer with WorldChangers for many summers, and this organization builds and repairs homes after disasters, and I loved working with them. It was amazing to see the results of your efforts in real time, and how it can improve and impact the lives of people in your community. So in graduate school, I decided to go into International Disaster Management, but they didn’t have that as a major, so they made one just for me. There was a devastating earthquake in Nepal, and so I traveled there to volunteer with an organization called All Hands, and there was a lot of work to be done. While there, I had a “mid-master’s crisis” of sorts, and I decided that it was not the path I wanted to take as a career, for a number of reasons. Once back in North Carolina, I took a class on Nuclear Non-Proliferation Policy with Dr. Robert Riordan, and I loved it! He put me in touch with the right people and information that sparked my interest in nuclear policy.

3 – (17:36) Emerging Programs on Nuclear Policy

Naomi Senehi: That’s fortunate that they had a program in nuclear policy, because those two fields can go pretty hand in hand.

Jackie Kempfer: Exactly, I’m starting to hear about more formal programs that combine nuclear and policy studies. I returned to Dr. Riordan’s class a couple years ago, and was amazed to find that half the class was, in fact, nuclear engineering students. I see programs like this at UC Berkeley, Princeton, etc.

(Naomi Senehi: Why did you take that nuclear non-proliferation class in the first place?)

Jackie Kempfer: The history aspect of the course was comforting because I was confident in that area, and the nuclear side was just new enough and exciting enough to peak my interest. I had one class on International Political Economy, which I struggled with, but was also really rewarding and useful for my upcoming career.

4 – (21:41) Post-graduate Experience at Stimson

Naomi Senehi: So tell me what happens after you receive your Master’s?

Jackie Kempfer: Just before graduating, actually, I did an internship with the Stimson Center here in DC, which was an amazing opportunity, but it was unpaid and so Dr. Betcher was a huge help in getting me funding to afford to be able to live and work in DC. Simultaneously, I was finishing up my thesis on Nuclear Non-Proliferation, specifically on the break of the Soviet Union’s “Nuclear Disinheritance” and the negotiation process between the US, Russia & Ukraine. After graduation, I received a job offer from Stimson, and got to briefly meet Cindy Vestergaard, who I’d really wanted to work with. I enjoyed her work on the nuclear fuel cycle. I loved that Stimson allowed me to work with many talented women in the industry, and I learned a lot about Nuclear Security and the nuclear world of DC. It was a lot of new information all at once, but it was very rewarding to connect me with organizations and people around Nuclear Security. My main project there was a draft for an Organizational Governance Template for Nuclear Security. It was a great industry-led initiative.

5 – (31:26) Organizational Governance Template for Nuclear Security and Beyond

Naomi Senehi: Tell me more about this Organizational Governance Template for Nuclear Security.

Jackie Kempfer: It’s been quite a few years in the making and is about to go into action. We wanted it to be an international effort to enforce an exact structure for security, but we call it a template because we recognize that each facility is different and the template should be adapted as such. It all started with looking for ways to incentivize nuclear security that goes above and beyond basic compliance from the NRC, in areas such as insurance and liability. For example, we held a mock trial for a mixed physical/cyber attack on a facility. Half of the trial ran without reference of the Governance Template, and the other half included it, which illuminated to us its potential purpose. It can be used as a way to illustrate that an operator has done everything reasonably practicable to uphold security. It was a great project to get me involved with the nuclear industry.

Then I found myself wanting to focus more on energy and climate change, while still being involved in nuclear security, and Susie Baker gave me the opportunity to do just that. I joined in on her project at Third Way, looking at advanced reactors & safeguards for security.

6 – (39:35) Work at Third Way

Naomi Senehi: So tell me about Third Way.

Jackie Kempfer: Third Way is a Center-Left Democrat Think Tank, with various programs like National Security, Education, etc., and I am in the Clean Energy program. It’s about 40 people, all here in DC, and 5 or 6 of us in Clean Energy, plus our outside partners. It’s very collaborative with other organizations, which is great. We support technology-inclusivity to clean energy; whatever means of energy production with zero carbon emission. The 3 main and largest areas of emissions that we look at are power, transportation, and industry. With nuclear, it’s a split narrative: we need to evaluate our existing fleet, as well as innovating for the future of nuclear. We’re seeing many plants undergoing premature shutdowns as a result of financial competition with natural gas. Each state handles this problem differently. Ohio, for example, has issued a new Clean Air Fund, which protects the existing fleet, but is detrimental to renewable energy sources. I believe we need an inclusive clean energy policy that does not have to boost one energy source at the cost of tearing down another. The Nuclear Energy Leadership Act (NELA) was just introduced, and I think it’s doing a lot of great work.

7 – (49:46) The Nuclear Energy Leadership Act (NELA)

Naomi Senehi: So tell me about NELA.

Jackie Kempfer: NELA poses a deadline to have 2 advanced reactor demonstration projects completed by 2025, and two additional ones by 2035, as a development to combat climate change. There are power purchase agreements with the federal government in the act, which is really a message to private investors to show that it’s a safe investment. I’m excited about it because it brings the nuclear and clean energy community together, right at the intersection of engineering and policy. I believe it also gives aspiring engineering students an exciting outlet where they can put their career energy.

8 – (53:17)

Naomi Senehi: Many people don’t see how nuclear can be used to combat climate change, don’t you think?

Jackie Kempfer: Absolutely. A hope for me is to get the clean energy “tribes” to come together more, and to see that we’re all coming from the same place. I’m doing research into how advanced nuclear can be complimentary to renewables. Until now, those two worlds have not had many opportunities to come together too often. One of our biggest struggles is thinking about how to present nuclear to people that don’t readily understand nuclear or engineering. One idea was to go to Comic Con – superheroes, Iron Man & the Simpsons, etc. For the future of nuclear, I hope to see nuclear fusion, initiatives in space evolution with nuclear to colonize Mars and beyond. The more that that kind of technology is advanced, then the more advancement can come to nuclear security policy and clean energy. I look forward to collaborative thinking across the energy spectrum.

Q1 - Applications of Medical Physics

Naomi Senehi: How did you get into the nuclear field?

Evan Sengbusch: Evan Sengbusch grew up in Ames, Iowa, and studied physics and math at the University of Iowa. He was interested in experimental particle physics and spent some time as an undergraduate at CERN in Switzerland working on the collider. Through a research opportunity on campus, Sengbusch got involved in medical physics at the Positron Emission Tomography Imaging Center, which uses radioisotopes for medical imaging. In his early years of studying physics, Sengbusch focused on theoretical physics, but began to explore more applied applications doing experimental plasma physics before spending time at CERN. He appreciated the immediate impact of his work on the patients coming through on a daily basis, utilizing new isotopes that he worked to develop. Evan Sengbusch completed his PhD in medical physics at the University of Wisconsin and become connected with his advisor “Rock” Mackie, well known in the field and a serial entrepreneur. Mackie started a company called TomoTherapy, which put a linear accelerator on a gantry and treat patients in a helical fashion for medical therapy. Sengbusch discovered that he liked the fast pace of industry. His PhD defense was on compact proton therapy systems for cancer treatment, which was directly related to his work with CPAC (Compact Particle Accelerator Corporation).

Q2 - Proton Versus Photon Therapy

Naomi Senehi: What problem were you trying to solve with your research in medical physics and what challenges did you face?

Evan Sengbusch: Evan Sengbusch’s doctoral research was focused on compact proton therapy systems for cancer treatment. Currently technology for cancer treatment includes chemotherapy chemicals or external beam radiation therapy, which shoots high energy x-rays into a body targeted to kill cancer cells. An alternative treatment is proton therapy; protons are heavy particles whose depth can be controlled by the energy in the particle. Photons go all the way through the body and damage healthy tissue behind the cancer. It is difficult to accelerate protons to appropriate beam energies and currents for treatment. Sengbusch’s research focused on how to bring the size and cost of the equipment down to be more manageable practical so more people can get access to this treatment. Beam current, treatment angle, and gantry angle is started to become an automated optimization problem that can bring cost down. Evan Sengbusch started working with Phoenix right out of graduate school in 2012. Phoenix makes lower energy, higher current deuteron accelerators. Deuterium is an isotope of hydrogen. Deuterons are accelerated into deuterium and tritium targets to generate nuclear fusion, producing neutrons. Challenges include creating neutron sources that are strong enough to provide the right energy spectrum and flux to the target and developing targets that are specific enough to target only cancer cells and not normal tissue.

Q3 - Medical Radioisotope Production

Naomi Senehi: How does the number of treatments that you need with the NCT compared to proton therapy and photon therapy?

Evan Sengbusch: There is an opportunity to do a smaller number of fractions for different cancer therapies. Each treatment is a fraction to get up to a total accumulated dose in order to prevent acute side effects to the normal tissue if it were exposed to all the radiation at once. Hypofractionation, a smaller number of fractions, is being explored with photon and proton therapy. Phoenix received an award from the Department of Energy (DOE) in 2009 to develop a domestic supply of the medical radioisotope Molybdenum 99 (Moly-99), which is used in medical imaging procedures such as single-photon emission computed tomography (SPECT) and cardiac stress tests. Moly-99 is only made at nuclear reactors and there is a limited number of reactors designed appropriately to make it, all outside the Western hemisphere. Phoenix developed a proposal to use an accelerator-driven neutron source with a low-enriched uranium subcritical assembly around it. Nuclear fission is induced and one of the byproducts is Moly-99. In 2010, Phoenix started SHINE Medical Technologies which is currently building a production facility dedicated to producing Moly-99 with this technique. Commercial production of isotopes is expected in 2021 and to produce half of the world’s demand of Moly-99.

Q4 - Neutrons as a Visualization Tool

Naomi Senehi: Why did Phoenix break off into SHINE to complete Moly-99 production as a partner company?

Evan Sengbusch: Phoenix has grown outside of the medical industry and takes its products to the Department of Defense (DOD) and the nuclear energy industry. Phoenix’s founder needed private investment to get the high volume medical radioisotope production and started SHINE to manage this portion of work. One of Phoenix’s core innovations was utilizing a gaseous as opposed to a solid target. Approximately ten times the number of neutrons are produced with a gaseous target. The system has a large differential pumping section which creates a billion times pressure differential between the target regime, where neutrons are generated, and the accelerator side, where the deuterium ion beam is accelerated to induce the reaction. For the DOD, Phoenix is developing systems that use neutrons as an inspection tool as they pass through an industrial component to provide visualization. Neutrons are good at penetrating high density material to visualize low density material, which is different that how x-rays function. This could be used to find defects inside energetic systems.

Q5 - Accelerator-based Imaging Systems

Naomi Senehi: What’s the cost difference of x-ray versus accelerator-based system?

Evan Sengbusch: Accelerating ions is harder to accelerate electrons as done with x-rays, so neutron systems are more expensive today than x-ray systems. X-ray inspection systems have also been built for decades, whereas neutron systems are fairly early in development. SHINE has signed supply agreements with a number of customers who take Moly-99 and put them into a generator, which allows Moly-99 to decay into Technetium, the useful isotope that goes into the patient. General Electric looked at modifying a power reactor to product Moly-99, but the modifications required to get access to the core was not economical. Due to this, only research reactors are used for production.

Q6 - Neutron-based Inspection of Nuclear Fuel Rods

Naomi Senehi: What is it like being pro-nuclear but competing head on with nuclear for radioisotope production?

Evan Sengbusch: Evan Sengbusch does not see Phoenix technology as a replacement for nuclear reactors. The technology is not aimed at producing energy at this time, but Phoenix does build neutron-based inspection systems that measure enrichment of nuclear fuel before it goes to refuel power generating reactors. Each pellet is designed to have a certain enrichment along a reactor’s profile, based on neutronic and heat distribution. Incorrect levels of enrichment in fuel rods could cause a localized hot spot, affect distribution of neutrons, or cause a cracked fuel rod that becomes a big clean-up problem. This enriched fuel is radiated with a high flux of thermal neutrons that induce nuclear fission; the radiation coming off the fuel rod is measured to determine the enrichment of the fuel rod. This process used to be performed with Californium, which is increasingly difficult to create. Electronic neutron sources are now being used instead of radioisotopes in some cases.

Q7 - How Neutrons Can Detect Flaws in Turbine Blades

Naomi Senehi: What’s in the future for Phoenix?

Evan Sengbusch: Phoenix is scaling up to build the first batch of eight accelerators for the SHINE project to come online in 2021. The company is also working closely with the Army focused on imaging and has a new facility called the Phoenix Neutron Imaging Center coming online in Madison, WI this summer. This high output neutron source will have two different imaging facilities tied to it. One facility is for thermal neutron imaging, which could be used to inspect turbine blades for residual ceramic in the turbine cooling channel. These turbine blades are currently inspected at research reactors, which is a large interruptor to the manufacturing process. The other imaging facility has a fast neutron imaging capability. Low energy neutrons are desired for smaller components because they have a higher chance of finding the ceramic material being searched for, but they have limited penetration. Sengbusch sees the biggest challenge as convincing the market to adopt new technologies.

Q8 - Future of Nuclear Fusion Energy

Naomi Senehi: What do you hope for the future of nuclear technology?

Evan Sengbusch: The original vision of Phoenix was to commercialize near term applications of nuclear fusion technology as a way to generate incremental revenue to reinvest in taking the technology to the next level with a long term goal of nuclear fusion energy. All the work Phoenix does will benefit future approaches for using nuclear fusion as a clean energy source.

7-10 Bullets
- How Evan Sengbusch’s background in particle physics led to a career in medical physics - Production of lower energy, higher current deuteron accelerators as neutron sources - Why a domestic supply of Molybdenum 99 is vital to the nation’s medical industry - How neutrons are used as an inspection tool for complex, high density materials and components - Role of research reactors in medical radioisotope production - Neutron-based inspection systems for enrichment in nuclear fuel rods - How the President of Phoenix, Evan Sengbusch, is commercializing near term applications of nuclear fusion technology.

Q1 - South Africa’s Atomic Energy Corporation

Bret Kugelmass: What is your personal history and how did you get into nuclear?

Eben Mulder: Eben Mulder is originally from South Africa, where he was proficient and interested in pure mathematics and theoretical physics. After serving his two required years in the nation’s army, Mulder became interested in the mechanics of explosions. Mulder started working at the Council for Scientific and Industrial Research where he transitioned from scientific to industrial work. Part of the Council had spun off to form the Atomic Energy Corporation; the Corporation sponsored Mulder’s education and Mulder started working on the reactor development program. The nuclear proliferation treaty was signed during Mulder’s time at the Corporation, which had previously developed a nuclear weapon. They tried to pursue fuel enrichment through centrifuges, but could not find the right combination of materials. South Africa also attempted laser enrichment. Mulder’s background is physics-based, but his PhD is in nuclear engineering.

Q2 - Challenges of Scaling Nuclear

Bret Kugelmass: When it comes to fluids work, is it easier to scale in size as there are inherently less boundary conditions?

Eben Mulder: All of the phenomena manifested in large fluids system, happen in small systems but may not necessarily be noticed or impactful. South Africa intended to develop a pressurized water reactor. As reactors are scaled down, the system should become simpler and a number of safety systems should be closed down. Nuclear energy works well in a submarine because it is surrounded by a natural heat sink. Eben Mulder doesn’t see economic benefits of smaller reactors, but is excited to see a reactor design that is intrinsically safe, which brings cost benefits. The Atomic Energy Corporation closed down the enrichment facility and many of the engineers went to Eskom, the state-owned utility. The utility, which is run by a majority of coal power, was confronted with looking at future supply side options including nuclear. However, the nation’s two nuclear plants were built 1000 miles apart, requiring massive transmission systems. Sixty-five percent of Africa’s utilities come from South Africa. The gold industry was very energy intensive and funded the start of the utility company, Eskom. The company comprised of three businesses: generation, transmission, and distribution.

Q3 - Mulder’s Introduction to Pebble-bed Reactors

Bret Kugelmass: How has the environment in South Africa changed over the years?

Eben Mulder: South Africa has vast population differences, which was effectively ruled by Europeans for many years due to its strategic location at the Southern tip of the continent. South Africa was vehemently against communism, as Russia was interested in the ocean transportation advantages of the country. Over 60% of all the asphalt roads in Africa are all in South Africa, but within the country, there is a huge contrast between the first world living and the developing side of the population. Usually, first world technology gets developed in first world countries, but Eben Mulder’s dream was to bring nuclear technology to the country. He viewed the only way to get South Africa freed from continually following the trends and bad habits of other African countries was to take nuclear technology in hand. Mulder studied nuclear energy in Germany, whose nuclear experts looked at South Africa’s enrichment processes. Their system had a fixed wall centrifuge which used turbines or compressors to blow hydrogen (carrier gas) into the cascading system to get the same effect as a spinning centrifuge and was able to separate the material. The helium isotopes and the uranium isotopes separated and were funneled upward. Once South Africa signed the nuclear proliferation treaty, the country eliminated all of its weaponry that it had developed. South Africa was not aware of pebble-bed and prismatic graphite-moderated reactors, but Mulder learned about the technology while in Germany.

Q4 - Cooperation Between Germany and South Africa

Bret Kugelmass: What is the TRISO particle?

Eben Mulder: TRISO particles are a type of micro fuel particles. Pebble-bed reactor technology was developed in the U.S. by Farrington Daniels. He suggested that the technology be coupled to a Brighton cycle, one method of converting energy into electricity using helium as an alternative to a steam cycle. South Africa had experience with turbines for the fuel enrichment program and had developed their own compressors. Germany was impressed with the technology, which used helium as a working medium, and suggested coupling a direct cycle to the equipment. Mulder was intrigued with the pebble-bed technology, and realized that the round spent fuel pebbles could be transported in pipes. Mulder worked at the research institute on the AVR reactor on-campus in Munich. The group agreed to allow Mulder to transfer the technology to South Africa. He wanted to understand the physics of the system and Germany sent some financial support to South Africa to get the program going. Mulder met the head of Exelon during a trip to the U.S., who visited South Africa and was intrigued by the technology. Eskom, at the time, was very open-minded about innovation, including installing 1000 kV transmission lines and built the first dry-cooled power station at Matimba. The dry-cooled technology was need due to the arid climate and the plant was built with over 280 fans for a 4,500 MW plant.

Q5 - Mulder’s Impact on Nuclear Education

Bret Kugelmass: What was the duration of the pebble-bed project and what happened?

Eben Mulder: South Africa worked together to design the plant and make the fuel pebbles. When Eben Mulder went to Germany the first time to develop code for safety of light water systems, he went to visit the THTR (thorium high temperature reactor). He was attracted to the technology, went to Eskom with a future supply side option, and returned to Germany where he met the gentleman who led the pebble development program at the research center in Munich. One attractive feature of the technology is that a majority of the components could be manufactured in South Africa and it could be built small enough to be placed near the areas of need. Strategic studies showed the companies being out of energy by 2008. Development was completed and the country put over $1.2 billion dollars into the program, but it became too much of a social program involving untrained individuals from Eskom. In 2006, Mulder left the pebble-bed reactor to look at the succession plan. He started the postgraduate school for nuclear science and engineering at North-West University, the only one of its kind in Africa. Student exchanges took place and the teams built test models in cooperation with the plant for $50,000. The cold critical facility consisted of reflector blocks with pebbles and could predict when the plant would go critical. Contour rods could be modeled with different code. Mulder sees success in new technology development with better people management and resolved issues with obtaining licenses, which complications the relationship with the client.

Q6 - Politics and Pebble-bed Technology

Bret Kugelmass: How did you get involved with X Energy?

Eben Mulder: In 2010, there was a new government transition and the pebble-bed reactor was abandoned to provide funding for the World Cup soccer stadium. Between 2006 and 2012, Mulder’s nuclear program at North-West University produced 150 PhD’s and Master’s degrees. Mulder handed over his code to the university program and assembled a team of experts to work together on a small 30 MW concept pebble-bed reactor. In 2013, the team came to the U.S. to complete a design review. Dr. Kam Ghaffarian, the founder of X Energy, reached out to Eben Mulder and invited him to work in the U.S. on the project. At the time, Mulder was director of a rare earth mine in South Africa that produced thorium as a byproduct of the mining operation. Mulder formed Steenkampskraal Thorium Limited (STL) which got a license to take the thorium that was separated and put it in the mine again to create a bank of thorium. Mulder’s families, along with seven others, moved to the U.S. to pursue the pebble-bed reactor technology.

Q7 - Licensing Challenges of New Nuclear Technology

Bret Kugelmass: What stage of technological development is the pebble-bed reactor at right now?

Eben Mulder: Eben Mulder is familiar with and confident about the capabilities and functionality of pebble-bed technology. Dr. Kam of X Energy pursues projects that make financial sense, looking forward to the impact on climate change the technology can provide. The clientele has been put off by challenges of obtaining a license for this specific technology. However, it is difficult to get traction in the licensing process without having a committed clientele. Mulder aims to demonstrate the capabilities of a full-scale plant in the U.S. first before spreading across the globe. If fuel pebbles are only passed through the system once, there would be a very high power peak and the top and very little utilization. Instead, the reactor is designed as a multipassing system in which the pebbles are passed through multiple times. Fuel can be withdrawn and refilled while the plant is online. The original design was a 30 MW once-through reactor.

Q8 - Evolution of X Energy’s Pebble-bed Reactor

Bret Kugelmass: What changed with the pebble-bed reactor technology?

Eben Mulder: X Energy’s marketing division completed a study of the market focused on which states are pro-nuclear and where replacements would be required. The current design is a 200 MW thermal unit. The designer must show that the materials are not being challenged in the power plant; designers use ASME standards to design within material limits. The plant’s inlet temperature of helium was prescribed at 300 degrees Celsius and outlet temperature at 750 degrees Celsius, still in a steam cycle conversion. A heat exchanger then takes the hot Helium gas and turn it into steam, resulting in a temperature of 550 degrees Celsius, a temperature adequate for processed applications. During construction and initial operation of new technology plants, some design considerations not made in initial stages are discovered and must be addressed. Mulder suggest sticking to the standard supply chain and what is known, instead of experimenting with new components.

Q9 - Value of Nuclear Energy for Future Generations

Bret Kugelmass: Why is nuclear technology important to you?

Eben Mulder: Eben Mulder believes that nuclear technology is a sustainable source of energy. If it can be made available to future generations, they can solve the world’s remaining challenges. Energy they need can be produced without the legacies that the world is generating in today’s energy production.

Q1

Bret Kugelmass: What drew you into the nuclear space?

Shane Johnson: In the late 1970’s, the accident at Three Mile Island occurred and Shane Johnson saw it as an opportunity to pursue a lifelong career in nuclear energy. At the same time, Duke Power Company was preparing to build the Perkins Nuclear Power Station near his home in North Carolina and the oil embargos were striking the U.S. Shane Johnson graduated from North Carolina State University in 1984 with a nuclear engineering degree. In 1985, Johnson participated in the start-up of the Catawba Nuclear Plant Unit 1, including hot functional testing and bringing the plant up from a non-critical status, to initial criticality, and finally full power capability. As a junior engineer, Johnson took instrumentation readings and collected data from control panels. Johnson was able to become familiar with these procedures at the university test reactor during his time in school. Part of Johnson’s responsibility in his current role at the Office of Energy is to assist universities by providing new fuel, removing spent fuel, and providing grant opportunities for technology upgrades.

Q2

Bret Kugelmass: What was your progression from a young reactor engineer?

Shane Johnson: Shane Johnson worked in the general plant support group at Duke Energy for about 18 months, then transferred over to Duke’s nuclear safety analysis group. This group was responsible for running computer codes and running Chapter 15 final safety analysis accident scenarios. Chapter 15 provides a listing of all the design basis accidents for a nuclear power plant. These accidents are anticipated over the life of the plant, with varying frequencies, and are modeled on computers to show the plant could operate safely. Johnson left Duke to join the Department of Energy, known as the Office of New Production Reactors, which looked at design and deployment of a new, government owned and operated reactor for producing tritium in support of the weapons program. The program was shut down and Johnson transitioned into the Office of Nuclear Energy in 1992 as part of the facilities group responsible for the U.S. test reactors. Test reactors were used to test materials and fuel irradiation capabilities, but also for stepping up sodium fast reactor technology.

Q3

Bret Kugelmass: What was going through your head over the years as nuclear priorities get shifted?

Shane Johnson: The Department of Energy (DOE) looks at resources available and capabilities of facilities at hand in order to put ideas out for pursuing new technologies or test programs. The DOE went through the environmental procedures to make the case that the Hanford Test Facility in Washington State, which had been shut down for production. The proposal was for the site to house programs such as fast reactor research and development, materials production, fuel development for NASA, and tritium production. However, the decision was made to shut the site down instead of putting it back into operation. Today’s industry needs a facility like Hanford, which can test at higher energy levels than typical reactors. Shane Johnson was closely involved in the development of Generation IV reactors and commissioned a couple roadmaps for near term deployment, which led to Vogtle nuclear power plant, and technology, which involved international collaboration for new fast reactor technologies.

Q4

Bret Kugelmass: What was the Nuclear Power 2010 program?

Shane Johnson: The Nuclear Power 2010 program was part of the near term deployment roadmap developed for Generation IV nuclear development. The Department of Energy (DOE) needed to demonstrate that the Nuclear Regulatory Commission’s (NRC) new 10 CFR Part 52 could be followed and predictably finish with a product. Part 52 allowed a future plant owner to make application for an early site permit to reserve the land for future development and also provided a combined construction and operating license. The DOE aimed to partner with the customer and utilities in the lead to help development and put through the combined license. Southern Energy picked up the Nuclear Power 2010 program to push forward with Vogtle Units 3 and 4 project, which was the first nuclear plant construction in the U.S. in over 30 years. Johnson believes the biggest challenge to the nuclear industry is perseverance. The DOE has decided to stick with the loan guarantees for Southern on these projects, showing that sticking to the plan is required for nuclear.

Q5

Bret Kugelmass: Are new nuclear companies thinking about how to reduce the time from plant build decisions to putting electricity on the grid?

Shane Johnson: The civil work required for the construction is the driving force in the time to commissioning for nuclear plants, not regulatory work. By reducing the footprint and material content of the plant, costs and schedule for earthwork and physical construction can be reduced. Advanced digital technologies can reduce the operating costs by limiting the number of on-site employees required for daily operation. Regulations require inspection and documentation of components on a regular basis, but advanced reactor designers are looking at how to automate the process. Shane Johnson is approaching 30 years in the Department of Energy, working in all parts of the program in some facet. Johnson aims to help policy leaders understand the value of nuclear, even beyond electricity. During day time, when renewable energy is higher, nuclear may provide surplus electricity; some current research projects are working on how to make nuclear work in integrated systems with renewables.

Q6

Bret Kugelmass: How do you keep track of all the new aspects of nuclear?

Shane Johnson: The Department of Energy (DOE) is committed to the success of nuclear and Shane Johnson sees cooperation in information flow between industry, the DOE, political leadership, and other stakeholders. The Gateway for Accelerated Innovation in Nuclear (GAIN) program was started as a response to the massive amounts of data collected from National Labs and applying it to new technology. The National Labs can help industry more rapidly commercialize nuclear technology. An auxiliary benefit to this relationship is the talent pipeline that comes from connecting the researchers, designers, and private sector individuals. The ability to move jobs across nuclear energy benefits the industry and brings relevancy to the National Labs.

Q7

Bret Kugelmass: What do you see coming next in nuclear?

Shane Johnson: Shane Johnson remains very optimistic about nuclear energy and believes it is here to stay in the U.S. There will be continued issues with contraction of the existing fleet, deregulated parts of the country, and economics. However, the nation’s university nuclear engineering programs have never been stronger. The private sector and the investment community is starting to put value on nuclear that was not present twenty or thirty years ago. The Department of Energy (DOE) wants to be an ally to the nuclear industry.

1) Timestamp 00:54

Brett Kugelmass: So what is your story? How did you get involved in nuclear?

Guest: I grew up loving math and science, so I was pretty sure I wanted to be some kind of engineer, I just didn’t know which kind. I thought about being an agricultural engineer, then I thought about being an industrial engineer. During my upbringing, my father and brother both developed lung cancer, which exposed me to the notion of radiation and nuclear, which ultimately led me on my current path. I went to MIT in Nuclear Engineering in a 5-year co-op program, which allowed me a simultaneous bachelors and masters degree. I had an interest in Radiation Protection, or Health Physics, in nuclear power, which I discussed with a professor in my last year of college. Serendipitously, a new joint program was being initiated between MIT and Harvard School of Public Health for a Master’s in Nuclear Engineering program, with a concentration in Health Physics. Subsequently, I ended up staying another year in a Fellowship with this new program. That program was a great opportunity for the rest of my career and gave me an excellent educational lens for the industry.

2) Timestamp 05:41

Brett Kugelmass: What do you think is wrong in the nuclear industry?

Guest: From the beginning, since nuclear is a somewhat difficult subject to understand, it was seldom mentioned to the public because it wasn’t easily put into simple terms. Even today, the mindset is to lay low and not to draw attention to the industry so as to stay out of trouble. I also find that, generally, engineers tend to be poor communicators that appeal more to the technical side of the industry rather than the emotional one.

3) Timestamp 07:31

Brett Kugelmass: Are there other tactics that other engineering industries have employed for successful communication?

Guest: Certainly! Even the notion of a podcast such as this one is a newfound means of productive communication about the industry. In the past, the only representative allowed to talk to the media on nuclear-related issues was a company spokesperson, which discouraged employees to be proud and vocal about their occupation. Social media, however, has completely taken over the media, so the nuclear industry has to be ready for that just like any industry.

4) Timestamp 09:58

Brett Kugelmass: I got into nuclear primarily in relation to its effects on climate change, and I find that many climate change advocates won’t even dwell on the topic of nuclear, seems hypocritical, don’t you think?

Guest: Well, I believe that in the future, there is no way to meet our climate change goals without the aid of nuclear. It is a very important part of our current energy mix right now, especially considering it’s a constantly reliable energy source makes it vital. While wind, solar, and other renewables are also very important, it doesn’t complete the whole picture.

5) Timestamp 11:18

Brett Kugelmass: So did you end up pursuing the route of the health perspective within nuclear?

Guest: Yes; after going through this fellowship program between MIT and Harvard School of Public Health, I had a great understanding of both the technical side, as well as the health side of the business.

I was still in college when 3-mile-island happened, and my family lived nearby to the plant. So right before I was about to graduate, there arose this great crisis in the industry, and everyone was sure I would change my major. But I saw this as an opportunity because the industry was in need of reliable and educated professionals then more than ever. So after the fellowship, I worked in radiation protection for both a consulting firm, then for Boston Edison Company in administration. Then I went to working within the Pilgrim plant as radiation protection manager, and then I moved into Operations, and was in fact the first woman licensed to operate that plant. Then I moved to Illinois and joined Commonwealth Edison, first in the corporate office, and then the Plant Manager & Site Vice President. At my heart, I love the Operations department.

6) Timestamp 16:40

Brett Kugelmass: When first studying radiation protection, what was the theory on this threshold model? This still seems to be the one thing that the industry is fundamentally split on.

Guest: What I learned is still the basis today, but I am aware of the controversy. Unfortunately, the largest data source is the Hiroshima/Nagasaki survivors, the dose of which was exponentially greater than what we see working within a nuclear plant. The dose:effect ratio shows that the more dose they receive, the more serious the effects. So based on the data of the Hiroshima/Nagasaki population, the “linear non-threshold theory” shows that there will still be an effect even at 0 exposure. So we always try to minimize dose received as much as possible within a plant, keeping it all at low enough levels to not adversely impact people.

Prior to that accident, basis probably went back to the Radium Dial Painters: in the early 1900s, people recognized that radium glowed in the dark, so it was utilized for various things such as watches and dials, etc. The dial painters, mostly women, had to dip their brushes in the radioactive Radium, and then lick the brush to get a fine tip for painting. At the time, no one was suspicious; radiation poisoning wasn’t even understood. But eventually, many of these women died as a result of bone cancer from the radium. So this non-threshold theory is one of our first real data sets, though there are a lot of varying factors in reading that data. There is another theory, called radiation hormesis, which claims that low-level radiation is actually good for you: if a cell is already weak, radiation would kill off the weak cell that could potentially develop into a cancer.

7) Timestamp 24:31

Brett Kugelmass: Now that we’ve kind of seen the “worst case scenario”, such as with Fukushima, was there any after thought to revisit emergency planning?

Guest: There have been a lot of lessons learned, across the world, with various equipment available. Has anyone studied the radiation exposure? I’m sure someone has, but the way I see it, our primary focus is simply to keep all of the radioactive material contained.

8) Timestamp 26:38

Brett Kugelmass: You’re on the innovation side of the industry for the future, correct?

Guest: Yes. In the past, many people didn’t believe there was room for innovation in nuclear, and, in certain areas, I agree. The operators should follow procedure. However, there are better ways to conduct business, how to utilize our data most efficiently, and how to most effectively train our employees in a positive experience. One example of innovation in nuclear is virtual reality – If I can put you in a nuclear plant without you leaving your desk, then once you’re in the plant you are more prepared to handle it. Laser mapping also gives us more sophisticated and precise measurements of a plant for more accurate training scenarios. It also allows us to access virtually places within the plant that are usually inaccessible while the plant is operating, such as inside the containment structure, the dry well, or near the reactor. It’s also a great model for teaching and offering group class feedback.

9) Timestamp 30:30

Brett Kugelmass: Do you have any plants that are entirely mapped out?

Guest: We are very close at one – even from our top CEO down, we are always looking towards innovation, we even have a yearly innovation expo, which allows our employees to showcase their ideas. Last year, Damon John came and spoke about innovation, subjects across the entire company – electric cars, drones, etc.

We have 6 business imperatives that form the basis to our yearly strategic planning, things like operational excellence, organizational effectiveness, etc. and in 2016 we’ve added innovation to that list. And we’ve had terrific feedback.

10) Timestamp 34:21

Brett Kugelmass: How do these new innovation ideas develop?

Guest: I’ll give you an example: one new innovation is a laser that removes paint from metal, its very effective. When that concept first appeared, it was going to be very expensive, so first it went through our website called Reinvent, which allows multiple screenings from different teams at different levels. Then, if it gets to be something significant, it goes to our Innovation Review Board, who gives a final review and, in this case, passed the proposal and funded the project – and I’m glad we did. We just tested it and got excellent feedback. You can actually hold the laser, a bit like a leaf blower, and it’s very effective. Some of these innovations are cost effective, others improve safety or reliability. Although we don’t deal directly with our customers, we recognize that they are of vital importance to our business.

11) Timestamp 40:45

Brett Kugelmass: There is this great connection to the customers that everyone must feel, right?

Guest: Yes. And the other thing is that we had a hard hit from the polar vortex this last January. Our plants ran flawlessly through that extreme weather. Other plants find limitations, be it the flow of wind or gas, whatever. And while those may be rare occurrences, we always want our power, especially in those circumstances. Something that struck me is, say, European countries that are opting to shut down their nuclear plants, such as Germany. It makes me feel blessed that we have so many natural resources here in this country. While I don’t think we should be dependent on any one energy source, I also believe that nuclear has so many benefits that it has to be a part of the energy mix in a major way.

There was a lot of emotion after Fukushima, and in Germany’s case, though I don’t know for sure, I think that emotion might have been part of their choice in abandoning nuclear power. It’s surprising to me, though, and a shame, because Germany’s plants were so highly regarded, and its more than a matter of creature comforts, it’s a matter of national security for them, but I wish them the best.

12) Timestamp 48:30

Brett Kugelmass: So where do you see nuclear heading?

Guest: I think more and more people are recognizing the importance of nuclear power in our future. It’s currently still very expensive for many companies to build new plants, especially in the south of the country. MIT did a study looking at nuclear power in a carbon-constrained world, which gave some strong points: the government needs to supply some support, at least in small ways, be it building new plants, new technology, new safety systems, etc. In terms of our current plants, we need to change the market conditions; we need to level the energy playing field, and recognize what nuclear brings to the overall system, and ensure that the adequate financial incentives are in place. I also think the NRC could use some reforms to be more flexible to new design work. If we don’t see these changes in the US, we won’t be the leading model for nuclear in the future.